A View from the Arches of Death - Will Nackers (part 1 of 2)

From Mobile Assault Platoon 3, Will Knackers’ recalls his path from Kuwait’s staging grind to the convoy into Ramadi, onto the April 6 QRF chaos, house clears, near misses, and the July 1 blast that killed Sgt. Conde and sent Will on a medevac chain. While he doesn't always recall every detail, the stories he recounts are striking and emotional. 

• Kuwait buildup and the long convoy north
• First sights of Ramadi
• Early IEDs and the March injuries timeline
• April 6 ambush, QRF response, scattered street fights
• House clearing dangers
• April 7 contact and a sucking chest wound
• Air support flashes and the April 10 bug hunt
• July 1 IED, Sgt. Conde’s death, Will wounded
• Medevac from Baghdad to Germany to home
• Small-world moments and lasting takeaways

If you like what you've heard, this is a multi-part episode. Make sure you listen to the rest of the story

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If you are a member of Weapons Company or someone with a story about Weapons Company 2/4 in 2004, please come tell some stories with us - 20 mins or 20 hours! Help paint the canvas of an archival story for others to know what it was like. Contact us @ RamadiPodcast@gmail.com, or via the podcast website above. 

All music used with permission by soundbay: https://www.youtube.com/@soundbay_RFM 

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:38

All right. Let's tell everybody who you are.

SPEAKER_04 0:41

All right. Uh Will Knackers. I was a Lance Corporal. I was in Ramadi in 2004.

SPEAKER_01 0:49

And you were with Mobile Assault Platoon 3, is that right?

SPEAKER_04 0:52

Yeah. I was with Matt 3 that time.

SPEAKER_01 0:58

If I remember correctly, you were. I don't remember whose truck you're in. You remember I imagine you remember whose truck you're in. Whose truck were you in?

SPEAKER_04 1:08

Yeah, you know what? Um prior to coming out of this, like I did listen to a few of your the podcasts, and I'm glad I did because it helped me remember some of the stories. Um and now I want to listen to more because just it's putting together like the big picture of everything, right? Um hearing everyone. But I'll I'll probably say it's a lot, but just trying to remember who I was with, what vehicle. Like I can't tell you what truck number we were or who we were with, but obviously I was in, I know you had Pepper on here already.

SPEAKER_02 1:45

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_04 1:46

I was in the same hobby with Pepper. Argent Condi, um Vigil, Corpora, Neil, um and Privatar. You know, that was our that was our three ride.

SPEAKER_01 2:02

So nice.

Kuwait Staging And The Long Convoy North

SPEAKER_04 2:05

Um, yeah, I mean, let's just go to the beginning of where it all began. I guess Kuwait. Um, starting from there, uh, we just put on Generation Kill. I don't know if you've seen that or remember it.

SPEAKER_01 2:18

Yeah, I do.

First Impressions Of Ramadi

SPEAKER_04 2:19

Uh I work with the Navy Corpsman right now. He's like, Have you seen Generation Kill? I was like, I don't really remember it. Like, yeah, put it on, let's see what it's about. And they did a really good job of like capturing what it was like in Kuwait, like prior to going into combat. So it's like this is like spot on of like you know what we were dealing with and all the nonsense, and all the officers running around telling you like the shave still and like all that, right? Um so starting Kuwait, obviously the build-up, right? Like, what are we getting into? We're going to Ramadi, um, talking about the arches of death and going through all that stuff. Um, I don't remember too much about Kuwait other than just really sitting around waiting. And then um finally it came time to like get in the the big convoy and head all the way up to Ramadi and drive in. Uh so we were part of obviously the the driving up to um Romani. And when we're in that convoy, I know I listened to Kelly's podcast. And by the way, Kelly is like if I had to pick a guy, it would be John Bassalone, is Kelly. Like, in my opinion, like that guy is just a stud, like the typical like Marine, like you would envision. Um, but that's Nick Kelly. By the way, but as a podcast, he sounds all nice and calm and collected, but he was the son of a bitch. Um when it came to working with him, anyways. Um, but anyways, yeah, we're going up with that convoy, and obviously we did stop because an IED went off. And uh for whatever reason, I don't remember if an IED went off or we were trying to wait for an IED to clear because they saw one on the side of the road. Um, but we were just waiting. And again, it was like a really cold night. I do remember being really cold, and everyone was like trying to bundle up as much as they could. And I was the one that was supposed to be on watch, like up in the turret, yeah, like in the in the high back of the turret. And you know, I was putting my head down because it was just so cold, I wasn't necessarily sleeping. Not that you even could sleep in you know that cold a weather, but um so I put my head down for a bit, maybe nodded off, maybe not, but everyone else was you know did asleep, and so I looked back up and there's nothing in front of us. I'm like, oh shit. Um, so I kicked the driver in the head. I was like, hey, like we gotta go. Like we started moving. And so eventually we caught up to the rest of the convoy. Like, by the graces of luck, like I have no idea like how long those guys have been driving or if they got held up a little bit. Um and whatever reason, I had a Jessica Simpson song stuck in my head, like sitting there waiting. I don't remember exactly what the song it was, but whatever her hit song was in 2004, that was when I had playing my head over and over again. But um, anyways, so I do remember like we get to Ramadi, right? We go through the arches of death and we finally get to our base um and get settled in. Um, but you remember in the beginning, um, I know a lot of this podcast is about like, you know, what we did in Ramadi during that time and how our story kind of got lost. And we took over from the Army National Guard who was there, and we sent a couple of our guys out to do like patrols, and they went out and they came back with like kind of what the city was like and how it was going, you know, like, yeah, we got into firefights with the National Guard, and they were just like getting back in their trucks and wanting to leave. And the couple of Marines that were with them, they're like, you know, getting out, wanting to assault and all that good stuff. So I found that very interesting. Like, you know, is that just because they were about to leave, or is that what they were doing this entire time, which could have led up to you know, the the stuff that we had to deal with. Um so, anyways, we took that over from the National Guard, who was supposed to be patrolling and um, you know, doing some good work. Um, but you know, initially they told us, you know, we're there to win hearts and minds. Like um, I forget how long we took the doors off um to like show face and like be friendly to the civilians. I don't exactly remember how long that lasted, but I know it didn't last long. Um, once we realized like hey, they're not very friendly.

unknown 7:15

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 7:15

We're taking a small fire and their IEDs planted throughout the city, but um yeah, so yeah, getting to Ramadi and you know getting that intel, like all right, obviously we're not gonna be doing this, we're gonna be you know assaulting anytime we get contact. But uh I don't remember too much, you know, once we got there, kind of getting settled in, um, nothing really happened, right, until uh April 6th, other than you know, a couple IDs going off here or there, a little small arms fires uh going off here and there. Um, but yeah, I don't remember too much happening before that.

SPEAKER_01 7:58

Do you kind of remember your impression of the city when you were rolling in? Like what you like what you saw? Because it I I don't know about your convoy, because I think we might have been in two separate convoys, but we were in like the dead middle of the day as we were rolling in.

Early IEDs And Rising Stakes

SPEAKER_04 8:12

Yeah, I mean that's the first thing you see is that the arches of death and then the first building is just riddled with holes and you know, bullet holes falling apart. Like this is a great city. Um my impression was like, oh shit, like here we go. Like, obviously, this someone's been here before, and this has been you know a lot of firefights, and as we now know, Ramadi is continuously um whatever you call it. Uh they're probably still at war right now, for all we know. Uh but just not a good city, not fun to be in, and it was definitely bigger than I would thought.

SPEAKER_02 8:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 8:52

You know, the population, like I have no idea, like afterwards, like hearing how big it was. 300,000 or 100,000?

SPEAKER_01 9:02

It was uh 400,000, 450,000.

SPEAKER_04 9:05

Yeah, to a thousand Marines, so it's like yeah, we did pretty good.

SPEAKER_01 9:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 9:13

Uh yeah, so I remember it was pretty much SAS quo, I think, until or April 6th.

SPEAKER_01 9:20

Yeah, there was a couple small things. We did uh I think one or two Corden missions, and then we had gotten reports of of people hitting IEDs. It was not long. Uh again, I don't know remember exactly when your convoy crossed, but I know ours crossed the LOD at March 6th. And then the first major wounding that I remember is that I remember hearing about was McPherson when that uh that IED went off that blew off his jaw. And that was March 13th. I mean, that was one week later, so it wasn't like it wasn't like a long time. And uh it wasn't kind of like what you're saying, it wasn't real for me either until it happened to us. But the first IED we hit was on March 18th, and so it didn't take long for it to get to get serious.

SPEAKER_04 10:09

Yeah. Yeah, not even really knowing like what date we got there, so yeah. Not very much longer.

SPEAKER_01 10:18

Yeah. Well, then you said you kind of remember moving into April. What do you remember from April, I guess?

SPEAKER_04 10:26

Uh yeah, so April 6th, obviously being a big day, and maybe you can fill in the gap on this one. But that Golf Company platoon that got the initial ambush um by the anti-artillery or anti-air gun.

SPEAKER_01 10:46

Yeah, to my understanding, it was it was a like a 50 cal. I I don't know that it was uh any larger caliber than that, but I believe it was a 50 cal. It may have been larger caliber, but my understanding that it was like a dishka, which is uh R it's a similar, it's a 12 millimeter, so it's a similar to R50 cal.

SPEAKER_04 11:04

Right. But that that's the one that wiped that entire platoon out, right?

SPEAKER_01 11:08

Correct.

SPEAKER_04 11:09

So I don't know what the time frame is on that one. Um maybe you could help me fill it in as we go. Um but yeah, so we're we're the quick reaction force for that day, right?

unknown 11:21

Yep.

SPEAKER_04 11:22

And I know you guys have been talking about golf company also sent out their QRF, who also got engaged and took some wounded. Um, but all I remember is you know, hey, we got a mission, we got Marines hit, we gotta go pick them up. And so as we're heading out, we get there, we pull up to where those Marines are, and kind of what Pepper was saying, like that was our first, like we got there to get the wounded Marines, and then we started taking our small arms fire ourselves. Um, he returned fire, and that was pretty much the moment of like, all right, now we're finally in this thing. Um, this is what you know being shot at feels like, he's returning fire. Um, and I think from that point things just got really confusing as far as you know when if we actually got the Marines in the Humbies. I don't remember, but I know we had to break off to basically start engaging the enemy ourselves because we kind of got caught in the middle of everything.

SPEAKER_02 12:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 12:33

Um so it was once we realized like we're taking fire ourselves, we had to, you know, give backfire. So as we we really got separated quite a bit, um you know, Humbies were separated by themselves. You know, I found myself off with uh our machine gunner or the 240 249 saw gunner from Venezuela. For whatever reason, uh you know, me and him were completely separated and by ourselves.

SPEAKER_01 13:05

Um and you guys were you were a dismount on that day. So okay. So you were just with you and Valenzuela were off on foot. Okay.

Separated Under Fire And Street Fights

SPEAKER_04 13:13

Yeah, so it was like whenever we started taking contact, we kind of did our thing dispersed, but then we got so dispersed to the point where we're like, where is everyone? Like we didn't really have uh one goal in mind of who's going where and who's doing what. Um, and same thing, and that was the first time I saw the one of the insurgents just laying in the road, you know, basically dying and watching him die. So that was the first time I saw that. I was like, all right, um, moving on to the next thing. But yeah, it was kind of very confusing when that thing all kind of kicked off. We all went our separate ways. Um at some point during that. Um I do remember seeing Sergeant Condi, because I know he got shot in the shoulder through and through wound. Um, I remember seeing him down the road, like basically in a fight with the corpsman in the back of the Humvee, because he was yelling at him, like, hey, I need to get back to work, like care about me. Like, and Doc's like, No, no, no, like I gotta patch you up. Like, you've you've been shot, like, let me help you. And he's just doing his thing, screaming and yelling, and wanting to get back in the fight. And so I remember seeing that, and then it was just me and Valentuela for however how long by ourselves, and we're just kind of going from intersection to intersection, um, holding the corners, you know, making sure everything's clear. Um, and there was one point when we're at one intersection, and you know, he was firing and I was firing, and we were both like, you know, don't shoot, like next to our ears. And we almost did that same thing of you know what you've seen in movies, like we're just killing our ears because he would fire off in my head next to my head, and I would fire off next to his head.

SPEAKER_01 15:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 15:09

Um, but there was at one point, like, we figured out like, hey, these guys literally are busting people in, they're coming in by taxis, by buses, and there was one van coming up the road. Um, take a little step back. Um, we were the first ones to get A COGs.

SPEAKER_02 15:30

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 15:31

Remember the ACOGs, right? Yep. Um, so only every platoon only got like two ACOGs.

SPEAKER_01 15:37

Yeah, I think it was, if I remember correctly, it was only 20 for the whole company when we first went over. It was not very many people, right?

SPEAKER_04 15:43

And so when they came to our platoon, like, here we need to be two, and so how they divvied those out was who had the highest shooting score. Yep. So I actually had the highest shooting score, and so I felt a little you know confident, being like, oh man, they're gonna give me an A cog, you know, considering me like the best shooter in the platoon. Like, this is pretty cool. Um, but I think I forgot it that day. Um, yeah, the the one time like I could have used it quite a bit. Um, yeah, I left it back at the base. But nonetheless, we're all Marines, we're all marksmen, right? And good thing I was a really good shot. But this bus that was coming down the road, obviously it was coming right at us. And obviously, I could I could put two and two together, and like this isn't the school bus dropping the kids off to school, you know.

SPEAKER_03 16:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 16:33

So I fired one shot where I thought would have been the driver sitting. And as soon as I fired that shot, that bus just immediately just veered off um onto the side. So I was like, all right, perfect. Um, whether I just scared him off, hit him, whatever. He didn't he stopped coming towards us, anyways. Um and we just continued to you know do that for a little bit. Um again, not sure on time frame, you know how long this was all taking, but eventually we all kind of you know regroup, get together, come up with a plan. Um, and at that point I kind of link up link back up with Sergeant Conde, and that's when we kind of start clearing um some homes. Um and that's one of the things you know, Sergeant Connie always you know taught me is that clearing homes is one of the most dangerous things that we could do.

SPEAKER_02 17:36

By far, yeah.

House Clearing And Close Calls

SPEAKER_04 17:37

They're the ones inside hiding and they have the upper advantage. And yeah, but he drilled into us. It doesn't matter who goes in first. If you get shot and go down, just know that everyone else behind you is coming in. So you get shot, go down, next guy gets shots, go down. Eventually, someone has to get that guy, whoever's shooting. So that was just drilled in my head of you know, we need to clear these rooms, you need to go in, and you know, we'll eliminate the enemy one way or the other. Um, so we started clearing homes. Obviously, it's not the funnest thing to do. Um, that was the first time I saw a triple E. I don't know. Have you heard that term in the no?

SPEAKER_01 18:21

Tell me.

SPEAKER_04 18:22

Uh extreme ethnic event.

SPEAKER_01 18:25

No, no, no.

SPEAKER_04 18:28

At the time I wouldn't have called it that, right? I had no idea what it was, but right you remember seeing this. The wives, if their husband died, like they would completely freak out.

SPEAKER_01 18:39

Oh, yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, now I'm with you. I'm tracking.

SPEAKER_04 18:44

Like punching themselves in the face, like throwing themselves against the wall, like just completely losing it. Um, and I saw that, and so we started clearing one of these houses that we thought people were up on the roof. Um, with Sergeant Konnady, we go up, you know, clear the house, clear the roof, nothing. We come back down, and then that was the first time that I got shot at by an RPG. Kind of the same things that you would see like in the movies of Blackhawk Down, right? Like RPG right down the middle of the road, didn't hit anything, completely missed, but whatever it was by us and hit the building, you know, far, far away. Um so experienced that. And then at some point, this is where we linked up with I think Golf Company again. And I just remember helping loading, you know, marine after marine into the back of the Humvee. And like I don't know how I ended up on that detail or you know, why or what we were doing, but I was basically assisting, which I believe now or after the fact was that golf company that completely got wiped out. Um, so I was just helping putting all those into the Humvee to have them evacuated. Um again, that was like seeing Marines tossing grenades over walls at the same time, still being engaged in firefights. Um but that is really about it as far as like what I remember about that day.

SPEAKER_01 20:23

When you guys were clearing houses, did you catch any contact in the houses, or were it was it mostly like you came in, there was nothing there, you went to the rooftop, so that was it.

SPEAKER_04 20:33

Yeah, no, we luckily we never you know got engaged, you know, while clearing houses. Um, even the entirety that I was there, we never like experienced that. So yeah, we lucked out that way.

SPEAKER_01 20:46

Yeah, I mean that is fortunate. I was uh I didn't clear a lot of houses. I did catch a little contact in a house, but it it same. I'm glad that was not an everyday thing by far. It is not a pleasant feeling. Uh so with what you were talking about with uh loading all those Marines, I think the high back that got hit with the dishcoat, I think that was Echo Company. I don't think that was I don't think that was golf, or was it golf?

SPEAKER_04 21:18

No, you're right. That was Echo Company.

SPEAKER_01 21:20

Yeah, so to my understanding, the the golf company platoon that was pinned down, there was, I mean, there was a couple of KI and there were several very seriously wounded. Um but you had, if I remember and again, I don't know, this is I'm looking at my notes, but I didn't write down detailed notes. The golf company QRF was on its way from the east, and you guys came in from the west. You just happened to make it through to Easy Street, and the guys coming from the east got hemmed up near Saddam's Mosque. They got into another firefight and basically it relieved some of the pressure off the guys who were pinned down in the two different houses. So that uh that tracks as far as that goes. Do you know how much, just curious generally, do you uh like you have anything in your mind of how much ground you covered was like a couple of blocks?

SPEAKER_04 22:10

Um eventually I think once we got all the marines loaded and accounted for, that's when we started um bounding from intersection to intersection.

SPEAKER_03 22:20

Okay.

April 7 Contact And The Cummings Wound

SPEAKER_04 22:21

Um because I remember listening to Kelly's podcast. Um I was getting very Mad because um he would bump up to the next intersection that we haven't been to, and he would clear it with the Mark 19, and I'm just on foot, like running to get to the next intersection. Yeah, and by the time I got there, right, huffin's puffing, he'd be like, It's clear. I'm like, dang it. And he move up to the next one. Same thing. Clear. I'm like, Kelly, like save some, man. Like, like leave some for the rest of us, man.

SPEAKER_01 22:59

That's funny.

SPEAKER_04 23:00

But yeah, we covered quite a bit of ground that way. I remember after that, but yeah, prior to that, not really sure you know how much we moved around.

SPEAKER_01 23:09

Yeah. And you mention it kind of like uh peripherally, but it's weird how you get these like time effects where like it feels like 20 minutes, you look down at your watch, it's been hours. Or on the flip side, you you feel like it's been hours, and you're like, oh, actually, no, no, we've only been doing this for 40 minutes or whatever. Like you have no idea, like it all just completely blurs together, even when you're in the moment. It's uh it's a very strange feeling as far as that goes.

SPEAKER_04 23:40

Yeah, it truly is.

SPEAKER_01 23:42

Well, I know you guys started to evacuate the wounded, the guys that you picked up. There were several pretty serious casualties, and at some point the army came out and joined you and helped evac some wounded and disperse some ammo. Do you remember doing any of those evacs at all? Or do you remember anything for the rest of the day? Because I think I am piecing this together because I wasn't there, right? I was map two, not map three. But from what other folks have said, you guys evacked some folks and then you came back out uh to the same area.

SPEAKER_04 24:16

Yeah, that like I do not remember at all.

SPEAKER_01 24:19

Um then what do you remember?

SPEAKER_04 24:23

I think maybe I was blessed with like severely just forgetting things that were traumatic.

SPEAKER_01 24:30

I mean, it's also 20 years later. Yeah, so that's part of it.

SPEAKER_04 24:34

But even even like after you know, the year after it, I feel like I'm recalling the same stuff that I would have back then, but yeah, um, but no, yeah, I do remember like the Amtrak's coming in and loading a few more in there, and to be honest, I don't even know like there's zero recollection of how we got back to base, whose envy I was in. I feel like we got so scattered. Um, I was surprised like our entire platoon like showed back up because we were so separated and you know engaging in different firefights.

SPEAKER_01 25:11

Well, do you remember getting back that night?

SPEAKER_04 25:14

Not at all. Maybe it was a sleep deparation too, like who knows?

SPEAKER_01 25:22

Well, that is also probably true. All right. Well, then it kicked right back off the next day. Any uh anything that stands out from the seventh?

Chasing Insurgents And Moral Choices

SPEAKER_04 25:32

No, I do remember you know going back out and not not being as fierce of fighting, but still just a little bit. Um and I do uh Kelly and um Pepper talked about it, and I maybe it was the seventh. I feel like it was just a random day, but um when we were driving and we took contact left the day that um Cummings got shot, but we took contact left and they started engaging, and I sat to the left of Pepper in the high back Humvee in the front, and so as he turned the 50 cal to start firing, I was basically like I went to go return fire as well with the M16, but it was like as soon as he started firing, like there was no point in me firing. And then all I remember being told by the machine gunners is like the 50 cal is so powerful that if you're like just past the barrel, it's gonna rip your arm off, like just you know, really powerful weapon. And that's all I remember, you know, people telling about it, and so this whole time he's firing like directly over my head, and I'm like yelling at him like Pepper, like stop shooting. Like, I want to get out of this thing. I'm like punching him in the leg of like, dude, let me out. Like, I don't want my freaking head blown off. But obviously, he can't, you know, he's laying down suppressive fire and he probably doesn't hear me at all. Um, but finally, he knows he stops shooting for whatever reason, the reload or whatever. But I get out of the Humvee. Um, kind of returning fire. You know, I do my little slick tactical reload um to try and save ammo, you know, have a full magazine with me. And we're sitting on the berm on the other side of the street. Um, and then finally we're like, all right, let's go move towards these buildings or the houses that were we were being shot from. Um, and I remember there was a cow out front of all these homes, and everyone, for whatever reason, was shooting the cow as well. The cow was not going down, like this thing was a beast, but it had so many holes in it, it was pretty impressive. Um, but the one house that we were specifically all targeting, um, you know, that was the house that we were gonna clear first because it was the closest, and obviously the progression of clearing homes. Um, so we finally get a plan together, we start heading up across the road. We get to this house. Um, I forget at what point companies got shot. If it was, I believe it was after we cleared this house, but we go in, we clear the house, um, we move in, we check the upstairs, um, we come back down, and there was only one more room to clear um in the far corner. And I was the first one through this door, and I opened up the door, and it's a family of just women and children. And I'm like, holy shit, like for one, I didn't shoot them, but how they didn't get shot with being riddled by 50 cows, Mark 19s. Um, and I remember telling them, I'm like, you have no idea how lucky you are. And I just obviously took off and then we started, you know, doing whatever we needed to next, but that was definitely something that stuck in my head um that I saw. Um, and I think at that point, I think Cummings must have gotten shot because then we we pulled back versus continuing to advance to find um whoever was going after us. So um I do remember someone said when Cummings got shot, he fell onto the barrel of the saw. Oh so it had dirt jammed in the barrel. And so I forget who got to him first, but they went to pick it up to go fire it. But they saw all the dirt jammed in the barrel, so they didn't fire it and they couldn't use it, but um but knowing now that we're you know in the medical field that Cummings having basically a sucking chest wound, um obviously he needed some quick medical attention.

Air Support Memories And The April 10 Bug Hunt

SPEAKER_01 30:01

Yeah. Um did any and since you were there, and and now that you're bringing it up, and I didn't think to ask, at least a couple people have mentioned this. Did you guys render immediate medical aid or did you guys just grab and run and take Cummings to Combat Out or not to Combat Outpost to Junction City to uh the medical?

SPEAKER_04 30:25

No, we got him back to the Humvee to a Corman for sure.

SPEAKER_01 30:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 30:29

Yeah, I don't know which Corman you know tended to him.

SPEAKER_01 30:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 30:34

But I would imagine he got uh a chest sealed dressing of some sort.

SPEAKER_01 30:41

I would imagine he did. Yeah. I'll pick their brain whenever I talk to him if I ever get a chance to, but that's I I was just curious. I never really did think about that.

SPEAKER_04 30:49

Yeah. But yeah, forever, however long, how long it took for Cummings to get back, um the only thing he talked about that scared me to death was he said they you know stuck a tube in his penis, basically the catheter, right? He's like, that was the most painful thing, it was way worse than getting shot. I'm like, oh my god, that sounds horrible. Like, I don't want to get hurt or anything, just I don't want them shoving tubes in my penis, you know what I mean. Like as a stupid young marine, like just like the thoughts of why you don't want to get hurt, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 31:28

Yeah, he was not out long, right? He was, I mean, it's I remember thinking he was gone, like he was we weren't gonna see him again, like he was going to the states, we'd you know, we'd catch him later. Uh, and then it seemed like a week or two weeks, or not long. I don't know. He was back pretty fast, four weeks, maybe.

SPEAKER_04 31:47

Yeah, I couldn't tell you the time frame on that, but it was like you said, we didn't think he was coming back, like he'd get shot in the chest. Like, yeah, that should be a ticket home, but yeah, he came back. Yeah, poor guy.

SPEAKER_01 32:00

It didn't slow him down much. I mean, I remember seeing him in the gun and shit like that. He seemed like he was doing all right.

SPEAKER_04 32:05

Oh, yeah. Yeah, it dearly didn't affect him much. It's amazing.

SPEAKER_01 32:10

So again, I don't know the timeline for you guys for the seventh necessarily, but I mean what I know from my notes is uh you guys were in some fighting basically near like the soccer fields again down in the south of the city. And then that's when you were on your way back, is when you took contact, and then you guys were assaulting through, and that's when Cummings got shot, and then rather than push through, like you said, was there anything after that, or was that the end of it?

SPEAKER_04 32:38

Yeah, I think that was the end of it. We think we remembered the Cummings back and uh reset for the next day.

SPEAKER_00 32:45

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 32:47

Anything stand out after that?

SPEAKER_04 32:51

No, I think um I know we went back out, you know, looking for you know more insurgents and clearing out quite a bit um of the homes. Um just as we were patrolling, you know, I had a very poor mindset of I wasn't a very good listener, didn't follow directions very well because I just didn't, you know, care. So just young, a young guy, whatever. Um, but as we're clearing these homes, it's going through, it's like open land to small houses to a little group of houses. Um at some point we took some fire and we were trying to get to these guys, and we ended up on top of a roof, and we saw them, you know, continue to run away. Um, but as we continue to patrol, like I was messing around, right? Like not paying attention. And again, I find myself, you know, all alone. I'm like, where did everyone go? Like, I could have sworn I stopped for like a minute. I turned around and like there's zero Marines around. I'm like, okay, that's not good. So quickly, obviously turn around the other way and catch back up to everyone, but I just definitely remember that moment of you know crapping by myself again. Like um, so we catch back up, and I did have my ACOG this time. Um, but these these guys that we were chasing, and they're finally running across the field going towards like a wooded area. And for whatever reason, I know I had this guy in my sights, and if anyone knows the ACOG, it has you know different distances inside of the scope. But I had this guy in the very last you know, distance marker inside the ACOG. And I'm like, does anyone like, should I shoot this guy? Like, is he bad? Like, what's going on? Um, for whatever reason I chose not to pull the trigger on that one, but um, that was something that stuck out that I still remember from I think from that time frame.

SPEAKER_01 34:55

My guess is that you didn't see any weapons or anything, so you weren't real sure, so you're just kind of like waiting to see, or yeah, I think he probably had dropped everything that he had at that point. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 35:05

And the moral decision of I know this is a bad guy. Right. He's running away from us, but yeah, it's weird.

SPEAKER_01 35:15

They had a better camouflage than we did, obviously, right? You could just drop your shit and run off into the into the distance and uh do whatever the fuck you want. Put on a different some of them even would change headgear or they'd change clothes or whatever, or and just completely blend in.

SPEAKER_04 35:29

Yeah, exactly. And you guys you don't remember the Apaches and Huey's that day on the 6th.

SPEAKER_01 35:38

So I don't remember them on the 6th. I do remember them coming on the 10th. That was the only day I remember, and the only day I because I've seen some pictures and they're also annotated April 10th. Did you guys you had you guys had uh helicopters somewhere on the 6th, 7th?

SPEAKER_04 35:56

Uh that's probably just a lapse of memory on my part.

SPEAKER_01 36:00

Well, so it was interesting.

SPEAKER_04 36:05

Those things are over our heads.

SPEAKER_01 36:07

No, God, I went, I fucking wished I wished her.

SPEAKER_00 36:11

That would have been great.

SPEAKER_01 36:13

No, the there was um maybe three times that helicopters were were actually firing in the city, and one of them was April 10th. Uh, the other one was I don't remember the date, but when, and I can look in my notes, but it's when map one got in a firefight down at the reviewing stands, and then one other random day. But mostly no, mostly air was not uh cleared hot to do anything in this city.

SPEAKER_04 36:39

Well, yeah, that's crazy. Because in my head, they were there every day.

SPEAKER_01 36:44

Well, that's that's good. That's good. And maybe you were there for the uh for a couple of the times when they were there. Uh on the 10th specifically, which might be clear in your mind, you guys might have been closer to the area where they were firing by the river. Because my understanding is they were clearing they were firing by the river, but they also cleared a few rooftops uh from contact that happened. And the 10th was the first uh what we called the first bug hunt. That was the big cordon search and kind of the end of the supposed to be the end of the battle of Armadi as far as that goes.

SPEAKER_04 37:18

Right.

SPEAKER_01 37:20

I don't know. I do you remember anything much about that? About when what you guys were doing?

SPEAKER_04 37:25

The 10th, no.

SPEAKER_01 37:26

No, not at all. Yeah, yeah. We were on a like an outer cordon element, so I don't have a good recollection of what everybody else was doing, and so I don't know. I just remember them driving up and down the street with the speakers playing music and calling everybody out to fight, and then about an hour or two into it, people did come out to fight and it became a big thing.

SPEAKER_04 37:47

Right.

SPEAKER_01 37:51

Well, what pops up next to you?

July 1 IED And Sgt. Conde’s Last Patrol

SPEAKER_04 37:56

Um yeah, other than that, like I don't remember what we did from the 10th um up into July 1st, which obviously was when Sergeant Gondi got killed. Um so that was a big part of um my existence, obviously, in map three, um, being his platoon. But that so that day, that morning, we are we got a mission, you know, observation post. Obviously, that was most of what we did, I think. Um so that was one of our missions that morning. We're gonna go out into observation post, hang out somewhere in the middle of the city, uh, watch the intersection, hopefully catch some bad guys planting some bombs. Um, so we get out to where we need to, we set up, I dismount, I get to the intersection, the sector that I'm I'm supposed to hold and observe. Um and I don't know if I was just looking the other way, or maybe could have nodded off, who knows? But I remember looking back the other direction, and there's this cow literally like six inches in front of my face, just staring at me. I'm like, how did this cow get in front of me? And I didn't even hear him. Nice, so I must have to some point, but one of those ninja cows, right? So I was like, that was just a weird whatever. Like, all right, we didn't find any bad guys, but this cow snuck up on me, like, that's not good. Um, so we get back in the Humvees and we're done, right? We're supposed to head back, and for whatever reason, we didn't have the CO out with us that day, and he wanted to go patrol all the way to the arches of death, um, and then go back to um the army base where we would get our chow and everything. Um, so we get all the way to the arches of death, we turn back around and we're headed back to base. And so now I'm just thinking about you know what kind of omelet I'm gonna get at the army base, right? Um, and so as I'm thinking about that, the next thing I know, I'm waking up from being unconscious. Um and my first thought was like, oh, like well, that's an IED, right? Like, that's what that feels like. Um wasn't too bad. You know, I don't feel anything, no pain. Um, I remember Corporal Vigil in the back, you know, is anyone hurt? Um, you know, what's going on? And I was like, yeah, I feel something in my leg. And he's like, I don't care, like, get out and post security. And at that point, you know, Sergeant Connie would have been screaming, yelling, would have gotten out of the Humvee, you know, ready to fight whoever was gonna assault us next. But obviously he wasn't saying anything, so we all kind of subconsciously knew, like, you know, he was hurt pretty bad. And so I get out the post security, I go up to the front of the Humvee, you know, to hold the sector as we wait for the corpsman to come up to attend to Sergeant Gondi. And you know, this I remember specifically when we were driving that morning, like we were really far spread apart, like way more than usual. Um, and so we've at the second Humvee um in the patrol, and the Humvee in front of us was really far ahead. And so by the time I got out, health security, I was there for quite a while, you know, you know, minutes. But finally, Corporal Munoz comes down from the Humvee that was in front of us. He's like, Hey, are you okay? I was like, Yeah, I was hit in the leg, um, whatever, like didn't care. Um, they're telling Sergeant Condi. And he goes to take a look at my leg, and he lifts up, you know, my pant leg, and his fingers kind of like fall into my gaping wound from getting hit from shrapnel. And he's like, Gross, dude, like you're fucking hurt pretty bad. Like, you need to go see your carman. And I was like, Okay, so I just you know, just you know, being a last corporal, like whatever.

SPEAKER_00 42:16

Stop being gross boot.

SPEAKER_01 42:21

What what's funny is nobody knowing Eunice. Like, I can see him being like, say I can even see him saying that. That's that's that's exactly what yeah, that's fantastic.

Medevac Chain: Baghdad To Germany

SPEAKER_04 42:33

Right, so yeah, so I'm like, okay, so I go run um over to where the next dock was, um, and the other Humvee. And I get over there, and Gordon was in the machine gun turret in that Humvee, and the doc starts patch me up, right? Putting on the trauma dressings, and you know, Gordon is up there hackling me, like, hey, you freaking pussy, like, you know, stop being crying, whining, or whatever. Like, I don't think I was crying or complaining about anything, but just typical Marines like trying to, you know, you know, make you tough or whatever. I'm like, shut up, Gordon, like you don't understand. Um, but the doc he throws the the presser bandage on, right? Onto my leg, and um they get Sergeant Condi packaged up, and I'm not sure how many Humvees took off, but we were pretty close to the outpost at that point, yeah um, off the main road. And so, however many Humvees take myself and Sergeant Condi, and we get to the outpost, and you know, they have the medical staff there waiting for us. And I specifically remember one of the nurses or whoever it was, they're like, Oh, you're not hurt that bad, like you'll be back in a couple days or whatever. I was like, Oh, okay, great, like you know, we all want to stay there and continue to fight. Um, but anyways, they packaged me up a little bit more and they put me and Sergeant Connie into one of the helicopters, and we take off from there. And I remember quickly after we took off, we landed, they took Sergeant Connie out, and then we took off again. And at that point, I was like, obviously, you know, he's he passed away. Um, I don't know why they would have done that, or if there was a different area for you know KIAs versus wounded. Um, but they they then take me, I end up in Baghdad, and I get into the the surgery room in Baghdad, and one of the corpsmen or nurses, the first guy I see him, and all I can remember, you know, is from what Cummings had told me about this tube in your penis, right? So the first thing, the first thing I asked the doc was, hey man, can I just go to the bathroom before you stick anything? Um into my dick. And he's like, Yeah, man, like what are you talking about? Oh, thank you. Um, but anyways, and they put me in surgery, they knocked me out. Um, they removed the two pieces of shrapnel, one in my my thigh, like underneath my leg, and then there was another piece in my knee. They took those out, and when I came to you, I remember the doc came in and he had the shrapnel and a little peacup. He's like, here you go, we took this out of your leg. I was like, All right, thanks. Um, and then from there it was um several trips of airplanes and going back, but um they put me in a black hawk to fly to another Air Force base, and they put me on like the top shelf of this Blackhawk. And then as they were lifting me up in the stretcher, like I was just getting closer and closer to the rotor. I'm like, are these guys like trying to kill me? Literally trying to press my head as hard as I could against the stretcher so I don't hit the rotor. Um, but they put me in the black hawk, they take me to an Air Force base, and there I'm just kind of chilling out in whatever medical room they have in the tent. Um, and I remember they started getting mortared, and everyone like is getting under the tables, like getting off the beds, like hiding. And I'm literally just laying in bed still. I'm like, what are you guys doing? Um, and they're like, You need to get off your bed, like get underneath. I'm like, no, like I'm pretty good. Like, I don't think you guys are gonna get hit. Um, and if you are, it's just unfortunate. Like, there's no rhyme or reason or who gets picked. Like, you could be undercover under the bed, like it doesn't matter. Um I remember that, just remember the Air Force, right? Being, you know, weak softies hitting a base all the time.

SPEAKER_00 46:50

Um, this is on the back of getting shelled basically. I mean, like we took some kind of incoming like every other day for the last like five months.

SPEAKER_04 46:58

Yeah, exactly. And then uh at that point, then they loaded me up onto one of those medical C 130s where again, like you guys probably never saw it, but it was just how we flew over in a C-130, but this time it's just stretcher from wall to ceiling, yeah, both sides, and just it's completely loaded with you know wounded.

SPEAKER_00 47:21

So how much how much time has passed at this point? Like, uh is has this is this moving into the next day, or is are we talking yeah?

SPEAKER_04 47:28

I want to say it was like a day in Baghdad. Um and then maybe another day at this air force base. Okay, and I was on the C-130 back or flying to Germany.

SPEAKER_00 47:40

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_04 47:41

Um Germany's pretty quick. Okay, yeah. Germany was another you know, place for our wounded to kind of get stabilized. Um but I ended up in Germany, stayed there for three days, and then that's when I finally actually looked at my leg. Like this entire time, I never looked at my leg. And I looked at it, you know, one of the nurses with change and bandage or whatever, and then that's when the pain actually set in. Yeah, and I was like, ah shit, like now it's painful and I can feel it. Um, because I actually saw it, right? Like I put two and two together of like what it looks like and how it feels. Um but yeah, so then hanging out in Germany for a couple days, um, and then again another C-130, and they flew us to the East Coast and then to uh Camp Hamilton, where I ended up in the hospital at Camp Hamilton. Um, but one of the C-130s, I remember I was loaded up and they're loading more people onto the airplane, and there's this guy they put right next to me, and I recognize his voice, and he's like screaming and yelling and crying and all this stuff, and like asking for payments or whatever it is, like, or to adjust something. And I'm like, no way, dude. That's that's Anderson, you know, from School of Infantry. And I'm like, Anderson, is that you? He's like, Who's that? I'm like, it's knackers, man. Like, what happened to you? And he just got hit by a mortar, you know, standing on base, and he was all he was all jacked up or anything. But I just I you know recognize that squealy little voice from you know from anywhere. But it's just it's it's insane, like how you know all those small things you know come together from someone you went to school of infantry with, got sent to a completely different unit, and now you're all loaded up on the same you know, C130 headed home. Uh it's pretty crazy.

SPEAKER_00 49:51

If you like what you've heard, this is a multi-part episode. Make sure you listen to the rest of the story.