Fast Track to the Front Line - James Anderson (part 2 of 2)

We pick up Part 2 with James Anderson as he connects the experience of Ramadi 2004 to the weird contrast of other people's big bases outside of town, ship life, and the small moments that define a deployment. We talk reintegration, leadership that actually shows up for Marines, and how combat reshapes training, responsibility, and the meaning of brotherhood. 

• carrying Ramadi lessons forward 
• feeling the surreal safety of large bases compared to city outposts 
• getting tested by leadership games, inter-service friction 
• finding normal life inside the hooch  
• navigating family contact and never knowing the real timeline 
• First Sergeant Mack as a leader who knows his Marines 
• coming home, and a first night lapse in judgement
• learning why post-combat training feels fake 
• fighting morale-killing busywork
• reliving a rocket strike, a fire, a working party gone wrong, and a near miss injury 
• naming the Marines who stood out, the value of reunions, and what it all means 

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Transcript

Ramadi Legends And Hard Lessons

SPEAKER_04 0:07

Part two of our conversation with James Anderson of Mobile Assault Plato.

SPEAKER_02 0:12

You know, there was a time where it was, you know, I was the only one left in the unit that was it had been in Ramadi. Um and it still was something that, you know, I would talk about sometimes, or you know, uh, you know, when we're out on the training field and it's like tell a story about Gunny Maraki and then like kind of stop and be like, oh, he must be careful, he's up there watching you in that hill, you know, like making a legend out of them, you know, for the other, you know, for the other uh uh for the other guys and and and uh trying to explain like the intensity of what we did and the you know that the SOPs that were developed out of that is like map was a new thing and and became the standard. Um to the point that like at one point we switched our name back to cat, but it was still like plused up map. So it was they called us cat, but it was combined armor assault teams, so it was basically map. Uh they just gave us you know an extra, you know, uh extra couple trucks. Um so the thing was a little beefier, but you know, that doctoring was established in what we did in the lessons that we learned, you know, and learned in a hard way. Um I tried to carry that uh knowledge and weight on to the degree that I could into the future while I was there.

SPEAKER_04 1:37

You remember any uh just kind of shifting shifting away from combat necessarily. I mean maybe combat, depending on what it what you remember. But uh you remember other any other missions where I don't know, you might have thought they were bullshit or or they were unusual, things where we went like long distance or VIPs or any anything else?

SPEAKER_02 1:56

Well, I remember I remember we went, I don't remember why, is that uh we went to Fallujah, to Camp Fallujah, to pick

The Surreal Safety Of Big Bases

SPEAKER_02 2:05

maybe pick someone up. Um and I just remember it's like we we took a long time to get there, and we were always in the desert. Then we got onto base, and then it was just like the most big open desert, and like we drove forever on the base, and I just had a sense of like, what does this Fallujah talk about in the news? It's like I haven't felt this safe since I left the United States. Um, you know, it is just like the the juxtaposition is like I think maybe as a you know, uh being young, it's like I didn't at that time, you know, associate okay, this is a big outpost that's outside of it, that they're you know, the assault is from this base onto the city and it's different. But because for me, it's like where you are is where you are. It's like our bases were in the city. So if like if you're in Fallujah, in my mind, is like Camp Fallujah is in Fallujah. Um, but it was I just remember that was uh um uh something that stood out to me. It's like, man, this is just like this is nice. And then I think we stopped at I think we got a chance to stop at the chat. We always stopped at a chow hall when we were at a base.

SPEAKER_05 3:14

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 3:15

Um special little treat. Um so Fallujah, I think uh TQ one time, I don't remember what that was for either. Um, and then uh Blue Diamond and Junction City whenever the opportunity would arise was uh was always awesome, uh awesome time. Um I do remember getting messed with at uh Blue Diamond, uh me and Bass were on firewatch, and I don't remember why there was a rifle, why there was a rifle in the truck, or you know, because sometimes you couldn't take your rifles places, sometimes you could, uh, but like there were rifles in the truck, and me and me and Bass were on watch, and uh a colonel and a senior enlisted came up to us, and then the colonel was talking to us, and while we were being talked to, uh senior enlisted came went in the back of the truck, went kind of in the back, and then he brought a rifle, picked a rifle up and then brought it to us, and then I chewed our ass for letting him get the rifle. Um, it was like we knew we knew he was back there. It's like this is a colonel, you're a senior enlisted. It's like, yeah, I'm on fire watch, but like I trust you to not do anything crazy. Yeah, um, but then but we you know it was like they were just messing with us, and uh so we, you know, we stood there, we took our ass to and was like Roger that, Roger that, um, put the thing back. I remember we told we told uh uh told the sergeants what had happened, and I I don't remember who said it, but it's like you should have butt stroked him. It's like yeah, you know, behind me in 2020.

SPEAKER_05 4:50

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_02 4:50

Um but you know, it was that was a that was a dichotomy too, because it was, you know, the that showed like sometimes uh I don't it's hard to describe too. It's like there's two it's not there's two marine corps, but there is in a way, right? Because there's there's the combat element and there's a mentality and a uh focus, and then there's those that aren't that, and like the conflict between those two sometimes can be stupid

The Other Marine Corps Shows Up

SPEAKER_02 5:18

and annoying. Um and usually, you know, I've found that we're on the butt end of it, um for whatever the reason is. Not always, just like the navy. Like sometimes, you know, the navy is you some ships you're on, the navy works real well with you. Um on the Cleveland, we had a good working relationship with the captain, but then um on the uh uh one of the times we were on the Essex, it was like they were mad that we were there. You're like, what do you want me to do? I I didn't choose, I didn't choose this. Um, because like every time that every time that we had to offload was during XO's happy hour and everybody's cleaning, and they're like, you can't walk down this hallway. I was like, well, by I I think the XO knows that we're leaving the ship. It's like you have to so you have to argue with a different group because every every uh passageway that you go through is owned by a different chief. So you gotta argue with the different chief every way, from the from the gym, which is up in the front, all the way down to the well deck, and you're like, dude, what do you want me to do? What do you want me to do? Um so some ships it was okay, you know, some ships it wasn't. Sometimes they turn off the water on green days in the laundry every single time for three months when you're in the middle of the Pacific Ocean.

SPEAKER_04 6:30

Yeah, every single time, strangely. Right, yeah, right. Uh, I don't know how many times we got on and off the Essex on the deployment before you joined us. Uh I think it was six, if I remember correctly. I don't know. It was a fucking lot. Uh and it was never any better. No, it was exactly the same. Right. Well, cool, man. What do you remember of uh what do you remember of Hooch Life? I mean, you kind of talked about uh sort of being welcomed into the fold.

SPEAKER_02 7:01

Right. Um, I was a smoker, so I spent a lot of time, a lot of my free time was in the was in the smoke pit. Um again, like I said, I was always on fire watch anyway, so I just kind of hang out there anyway, uh, because it was either I was either just get I was either just getting off watch or just going on. Um and it was a

Hooch Life Smoke Pits And Games

SPEAKER_02 7:21

uh it was a a common place for a lot of people to kind of come through. Um, you know, and I like listening to, you know, in you know, the the stories and you know getting to know people. Um I read a little bit. Um and then I remember grappling was fairly common uh activity as well. Um especially with Bill. Um Bill liked to grapple. Um I I remember watching some Hodge Burn movies. Um probably the one that stands out the most is Dodgeball came out, and then we started playing dodgeball. So we we played volleyball for a little while over a map three's area um until the injury, um, and then it kind of died out, and then dodgeball movie came out, and then we started playing dodgeball. And I think I remember that it was just a random assortment of different sports balls that anybody could find. It's like I think the first iteration had a couple like had a softball and a baseball in there too. It was definitely not safe. Um I remember is like I remember that uh in one of those uh uh war stories uh episodes, they had the dodgeball game in the thing, but I noticed very specifically they did not include any of the audio because it would it would not be fit for public consumption. Yeah, that's accurate.

SPEAKER_04 8:48

Yeah, we were a very uh we were a very smoker-friendly platoon. We had two smoke bits. We had one in the front of the hooch and one in the back of the hooch.

SPEAKER_02 8:56

I was I don't think I ever went in the back one.

SPEAKER_04 8:59

Really?

SPEAKER_02 9:00

Ever. Uh I know map three's had had one in the back too. I never went over there either. But again, it's like I was the Buddhist boot. So like I also tried to I tried to be a gray man to the degree that I could. So like I didn't go new places, I didn't ex I didn't explore uh because I didn't, you know, I didn't want to get messed with, I didn't want to get put on a working party. So I just like I knew where my my little safe spots were, either in my rack or in the smoke in front of the smoke pit. And that's just pretty much where I stayed. Um eventually the you know, I think there was a in the front of the CP was where we watched the movies uh uh on rare occasion.

SPEAKER_04 9:39

Um it wasn't the CP, it was the um it was the support guy's hooch. So the the front of the CP had the radio and the maps and all that stuff, and then the the officers and a couple senior enlisted slept in the back of that. Okay. But the next hooch over between our hooch and the CP was where uh all the headquarters guys, the guys who were in the armory, the couple of uh radio operators that we had, but they right half of the hooch we had made into a makeshift MWR area, which literally just had a tiny couch and a little tiny TV and a DVD player. And weirdly that that uh that TV had a satellite attached to it, and we got like whatever, six or ten stations that never played anything worth a shit.

SPEAKER_00 10:28

Right. Yeah, that is that is where I was thinking, that is what I was thinking of.

SPEAKER_03 10:32

Yeah. Did you have anybody uh sending you packages from home or actually actually on that larger idea is you know what did what did your family know of what was going on? Did they I mean they had to know that you had just graduated from So I and got dropped immediately into a war zone? Um what was that like what conversations were coming out of that?

SPEAKER_02 10:57

Not a ton. I I didn't call home.

Home Contact And Unknown End Dates

SPEAKER_02 11:00

Um I think I wrote a wrote a couple letters, you know, mom and dad, um, and my my sister, um and received a few, uh not packages. It's like at that point I didn't know enough to even tell them about packages or like you know what I would need. Um and I honestly I wasn't even sure how long our deployment was gonna be. It's like, you know, because I landed with you, but like the question wasn't ever I didn't know for like a couple months like when the end of this deployment would even be. This is my first one. I didn't know what it was or how long it was supposed to be.

SPEAKER_04 11:32

So neither neither did we really. And uh anybody who was on the previous deployment didn't believe anything that anyone said ever.

SPEAKER_02 11:40

So right, yeah. I mean, I found that to later to be the like that's should be your default, you know, because we got when we uh on the 15th, when we uh went in as the first wave of the surge with the 15th mu, um, we were supposed to be there for 30 days, and then it's like uh 30 days is up, and two days later, they're like, Oh, by the way, you're extended for 15 days. It's like, oh, that's good to know. Then 15 days later, that no word, three days later, it's like, oh, by the way, we get another 30 days. So, like, okay, well, I guess we're just here for just we're we're just gonna be here forever.

SPEAKER_04 12:13

Then yep, those meetings are way above all of our pay grades, so we just uh we were just like, Yeah, whatever. When we leave is when we leave.

SPEAKER_02 12:21

Right. Um, so you know, they knew what I was doing. Um, I actually uh First Sergeant Mac found out that my sister joined the Marine Corps. Um, and he would check in every once in a while. He's like, you know, how's she doing? Uh I sent her a couple letters while she was there, and uh, she was scheduled to graduate um uh a little bit, you know, about a month after we got back. So,

First Sergeant Mac Takes Care

SPEAKER_02 12:48

you know, he would talk to me, okay, you know, are you planning on being there? Like, how's it going with her? Um, which, you know, first sergeant back was such, I mean, it was one of the best first sergeants that I had in my you know entire career. Oh, yeah, easily. Easily is uh so impactful. He like cared about his Marines, you know, it's just I can't say enough about him. Um, I actually ran into him after he left, he uh and became a sergeant major. We were on our way out after that um that second Iraqi deployment, and I ran into him in um um, I think it was in Kuwait, and he was walking with uh a staff sergeant and gunny, and me and uh another Marine were uh were walking towards the MWR tent. And you know, I saw him and I was like, oh shit, hey Sergeant Major, how you doing? You know, I was very open and friendly with him, which normally I never am with you know staff NCOs, senior enlisted. You're very I was very rigid, but I was very loose when in how I conducted him. And this staff sergeant just like whipped on me as like was ready to knife hand me right in the face because of how you know cordial I was with the sergeant major. And he just like grabbed him by the back of the neck and kind of moved him out of the way. And then he's like, Hey Anderson, how you doing? Uh good to see you. He's like, You were about to take me to show me where weapons the company is, weren't you? And he kind of just like puts his hand on the back of my neck and was like, Absolutely, I was gonna do that. You know, I wasn't gonna go to the MWR tan and make some phone calls, I was gonna escort you back to our hooch. So I brought him back, and you know, he was there for about 45 minutes visiting with the guys who were, you know, that is had still hung around. There were quite a few actually um that were still in the unit that went on that um Barwana deployment.

SPEAKER_05 14:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:46

Very cool.

SPEAKER_03 14:48

That's cool. Sergeant Major, I mean I can't speak highly enough of the man.

SPEAKER_02 14:55

Yeah, amazing. Strongest motherfucker I've ever seen in my life. Up to that point and after is like in seeing him in the gym, he's like doing pull-ups like he like I think he did a million of them every every time he got on the bar. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 15:13

Yeah, I I mean outside of like a Mr. Olympia, I I don't know if there is a stronger human I've ever seen. And and yeah, that but away from his physical strength, he took care of everybody. Like I feel like everybody has some random story where he was like he knew everybody's personal life. Like, how did you know your sister was in the Marine Corps? Right, you know, like he always knew stuff, he knew stuff and like came and checked with everybody all the time.

SPEAKER_02 15:41

Yeah, I think I heard him cuss once.

SPEAKER_04 15:44

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_02 15:45

Um it was after uh it was it it was when we were doing left seat, right seat. Um we were all at Junction City. You guys were still doing your uh you know the cluster fuck that you guys were going through. Um agreed. And uh we were having we were having issues with the army um in NWR with the gym and with the like the the game area, I don't remember what it was called, the MWR tent. Um we kept getting kicked out. Uh the Marines were getting banned from just for being because there were too many of us, I think. So we we got kicked out and then we went back and you know, we were grumbling about it. We told the first sergeant, and he's like, Oh, you know, well I'll take care of it. He goes and uh uh I think he goes talks to the the base uh base sergeant, major base leader. Um comes back about uh an hour or so later. It's like don't worry, you got full access. So we go back over, you know, everybody kind of hoards back, you know, over there because there's nothing to do. We were just sitting in those like nothing of uh uh living quarters, um, staring at each other. So, you know, everybody you know went to the gym or went to the M back to the MWR. It was like almost immediately we got banned again, and we went back and uh somebody told first hard were coming out of the hooch and he's he got told he's like we got kicked out again, and he's like, What the f and like I swear, like there's people walking, it's like every the entire scene like froze. No, everybody stopped moving and just like froze for a second. That would be a scary moment, and he then he kind of like and then he kind of realized, and then he's like walks away, he's like, somebody's gonna get their back dirty. I was like, Oh yes, and then it comes about an hour later, and it's like we never had a problem again after that. It was it was free and it was open, but so I don't know what kind of conversation was had, but he solved our problem uh permanently. But like I said, I still remember it vividly. It's like the like time froze. There was probably 30 or 40 people like out, and I swear everybody just stopped moving, like time stopped moving for a couple seconds. It was crazy. That's awesome. Maybe I made it all up in my mind, but like I still I still remember, I still remember it.

SPEAKER_04 18:16

No, man, that's uh that he didn't swear, like, and that was that was an and he also like he never really got angry. He would get stern with you like a like an old father style, but he would not he never got angry. You never saw him get so if he was angry, I would be terrified.

SPEAKER_02 18:34

I felt bad for whoever he was going to talk to. That's all I know.

SPEAKER_04 18:40

Well, you mean you're kind of talking about the transition home. Any thoughts about the way home?

SPEAKER_02 18:45

I know we had some it's like uh mandatory meetings. Is uh I think we met in the chapel and it's kind of we just it wasn't it was semi-led, I don't know. It felt like nobody knew why they were there, what we were doing. It's like generally it was like it's cool down, you gotta talk through stuff. It was like, what do you mean talk through? We all just like

The Ride Home And First Freedom

SPEAKER_02 19:08

we we're just here, we're ready to go home. So a lot of it was just like kind of sitting around waiting. He was like until we started like cutting up, you know, people started cutting up and talking shit. Um, and then they were like, Yeah, that's what we want you to do. It's like, okay. It's like we we were just doing this in the hooch. Like, what are we talking about?

SPEAKER_05 19:26

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 19:28

Um and then we uh we went uh yeah, we started transitioning back. Um I remember we drove back to Ramadi, or I mean we drove back to drove back to uh Al-Assad in the back of uh Seven Tons. And I mean that was uh that was a long drive, uncomfortable drive. Um I hate riding in the back of a seven ton. Um but you know, you realized how much of the country is just like nothing open desert for the first time. You know, because being in the being in the city, I know we we ran, you know, we do our runs, but you know, uh on those missions, there was we were there for a purpose. So I wasn't like paying attention to like the situation I was in as much as like looking out for threats. Um, even if it was long and boring and nothing, um, you know, looking through my, you know, my all I can see is through that little square bulletproof window. Um, but that was the time I really realized like there is nothing in this country except dirt in cities. Um and then we got uh we were at uh Al Sad for a couple days, I don't remember exactly how long. Um and then flew to Kuwait and we were there for a little bit. They had a lot of amenities there, I remember that. Like a bunch of fast food restaurants and stuff. Um and then we flew um uh com uh commercial back to Marshall Air Force Base. Um and I uh had a sea bag full of rifles that I was responsible for. So I think I I don't know why, but we had like six spare rifles and I got to carry them the whole way back. Then we uh you know got back to the armory, you know, turned stuff in and you know, marched back up to the parade deck, and I didn't have anybody there. Neither did neither did Bass. And I think we ended up uh just kind of wanting to get away from as many people as we could. So we went got a place down, you know, the boot move, we went and got a hotel on Oceanside and uh to hang out there. And uh I'm pretty sure that I I I don't remember it was that first weekend, but I think it was that um I ended up getting drunk and fell asleep on a bus bench in oceanside and then got very d belligerent with a police officer who told told me I couldn't sleep there. Um and uh ended up getting tased and uh thrown in the drunk tank.

SPEAKER_04 22:12

And um I wasn't sure you're gonna tell that story so I wasn't going to but yeah that was the call that was the call that I got at two in the morning. Yes. Right because for whatever reason I was still in charge of you and I don't know why.

SPEAKER_02 22:25

I was like we're in the rear fucking call it call the first star leave me alone. So I you know I was uh you know I just lost you know lost control of myself that that night uh you know my first night of freedom and I just kind of uh wasn't paying attention and you know went out on my own you know for the f on my own for the first time in months really after you know being surrounded and you know someone always having your back um I just kind of struck out on my own and then I made a made a mistake. Thankfully you know by the grace of God uh the police officer took the pity on me uh knowing I just came back and you know he had a connection I think with through some way because uh I got uh let go I got dropped off at the OD and uh he's like so you didn't get arrested it's like yeah just go back to the uh go back to your room you know stay out of trouble and then you came in uh you and uh the LT came into my room Monday morning and knew the story so I don't know maybe like the guy knew somebody who knew LT or something it was just like um I had made up a story in my mind because I couldn't completely remember and he's like well actually you were a belligerent asshole and uh got what you deserved um and got lucky on top of it um so but like that kind of snapped me back into reality of like you know we still got responsibility you know I lost lost control of uh my thoughts for a minute then it was like all right we're in you you're still you got things to do you're gotta be responsible um and I didn't make a mistake like that for for a while won't say not forever but for a while sure man we all we all fall out of the saddle every once in a while but I remember that one specifically because I remember being called in the middle of the night yeah you I knew you were not happy about that phone call and then you were even less happy that Lieutenant already also knew about the story.

SPEAKER_04 24:24

Well yeah man we can't even save your ass once the officers know so it but nothing happened.

SPEAKER_02 24:29

I mean as far as I know you didn't catch any charges we didn't give you nothing yeah nothing it was I mean we didn't give you a page 15 or anything yeah it's nothing nothing it was uh it was the uh it was a very embarrassing to me slap on the slap on the wrist which you know I'm I'm grateful for um another thing about returning uh we quit we quickly I think there were we had boots almost immediately when we got back yep um they may have got dropped like right before we got back I I don't remember the exact timeline um but you know I was still a P I was still a PFC and um I was grateful at how quickly I mean I was I was treated as senior you know I and my uh moniker evaporated immediately is like never to be heard again um you know so it was like and I was kind of surprised about that that happened but it was like it was also reassuring you know that I had you know kind of earned my place to be a part of the you know of the crew wait you're saying nobody you're saying nobody called you ship boots anymore uh not in front of a boot ever. God damn it I'm just kidding. Yeah that's awesome I mean I became Andy that was like that became my new uh moniker uh in call sign from that point on you know and then as I grew as I great as I gained rank then it was you know corporal andy or sergeant andy um that was from that point on but you know I was kind of worried about that you know getting being because I was the same rank as all those guys but I was still also trying to figure out you know what is seniority uh because the marine corps is like it's not just about rank it's about time it's about experience there's a lot of things that go into that and I'm still you know at that point I hadn't even been in the marine corps a year so I'm still trying to figure that out that's crazy that's so that's so crazy to think I did yeah holy shit uh by by that ball my sister was actually she had graduated and she was a linguist so she was in Monterey at the language school and since she was close by she invited me to her ball so I go up there in my pickle suit and I'm a PFC with a car walking into a ball with uh officers and senior staff NCOs and you know in of different ranks and it's like it was crazy how I got treated by all those people who were there and they were just like uh dumbfounded that that was possible you know that you know like the officers you know wanting to like oh yeah and they want to talk to me and they want to like oh yeah dance with my wife and this is like over and over all night it was it was it was crazy that's pretty crazy you had one of the wildest first years man that's insane I mean that was that was almost one year to the day because I got to I got to boot camp on November 10 2003 so one year later I was at oh shit I was at a ball in uh Monterey with you know the language school with the combat action room what what was uh day one at boot camp like uh for uh on the Marine Corps birthday day yeah no shit did they did they do did they do anything special did you get cake no we we did not get cake uh I mean I think they were I think they were like they were rougher on us because they were the guys who are on duty the receiving journal instructors I think they were especially annoyed to be on duty on that day um yeah like I believe that story so we have a we had a lot of you know move over here move over there it's like we scrubbed us we scrubbed an an empty squad bay um and a bathroom that have been just like destroyed I think they I think they all like used the bathroom in the most obnoxious way before sending us in there because it was I have never again seen a bathroom that dirty in the Marine Corps that wanted to be clean.

SPEAKER_04 28:26

That's awesome they invited every girl instructor to come take a shit there so you can clean it up right that's awesome uh well kind of reeling it back just uh for a minute you mentioned a couple of guys' names I'm just curious if anybody else stood out from the platoon you've kind of mentioned Randall and you've mentioned tweeter and tweet is there anybody else who you thought you could think of or any stories of anybody that uh kind of stand out to you um I remember Metroca

Why Training Felt Fake Afterward

SPEAKER_04 28:54

um I had uh guard duty with him a few times um up on the bridge post yeah yeah okay that had to been very interesting because Metroca is very high energy yeah and a in a talker it was actually those were the fastest posts that I experienced because he just he just would talk about all kinds of stuff he had a bunch of things to talk about yeah but what I but I do remember him saying specifically is like he's like you know what is like uh training is ruined for you forever I was like you know what are you talking about he's like after you it after this experience it's like the normal training that you're gonna do is gonna feel like boring BS and he was mostly right because you know training is important and but there's all these like uh safety things that you have to put into place and it's like it changes the scenario you try and make it realistic but it is like very often so unrealistic because of the controls that you have to put in you're like you're like there's a pull between that safety and it's like I want my guys to understand what it is going to be like in the ways that these constraints prevent them from knowing like how do you present the dichotomy between the two um you know I don't want my driver we did a uh uh vehicle movement like fire movement course uh I don't remember exactly where we were at but like so there's already gun positions so you know where you're going but like they for safety we put cones in the position with white tape so you have to pull in between the cones like it wasn't good enough that there was a gun position here you had to have cones and you're like it's like I don't want my driver looking for cones on the battlefield it's like they're not gonna be there um it's just things like that it's like I couldn't unsee when those things it's like this just doesn't make sense and it's like well you can bring it up but you're also gonna be told to shut up because you're not the you're not the OIC um who's who's responsible for safety. So you know that always stood out but he was he was right and you know maybe more right than he even he even recognized but I I tried to use that as a like a way to identify things that I could teach past uh for my guys um so that we highlight the constraint constraints as a teaching tool as opposed to a limitation um and hopefully I did that you know successfully sometimes well that's I mean you bring up a good point because I I've asked a lot of people that how did you carry some of the lessons forward that you kind of I mean shit man you were drinking from a fire hose you you showed up and we were like okay good luck here you go you're a dismount and then you're in the gun and everything else so you learned all the lessons fast well I mean what it taught me is like like we're a weapons company you have to know everything in this platoon is like I don't care that you're a 52 51 uh 31 um in this platoon like you're a machine gunner you're a tow gunner you're uh you know you're an assault

Weapons Company Must Learn Everything

SPEAKER_04 32:10

man it's like you have to know you're a lineman it's like you have to know how to do it you're gonna be the bet you're gonna be a better uh 11 than the 11s you're gonna be the best 31 like and that's what we pushed and that's what we tried to train to because of how much we did dismounted and from a truck you know realizing that you know a uh line a line squad is 13 people is like well your section is like you might have five it's like you have a fire team plus when you're doing it and you're gonna have to do the same thing that they do in an urban environment so you have to be better at it.

SPEAKER_02 32:47

It's like now we also have heavy guns and we can we can use those we have that we have those capabilities that they don't so we have to think about that too and how can we multiply our force uh to take advantage of that but like you're kicking a door in is like well you have the guys you have that machine gun is outside like well they're not firing at the building you're going in because you're in it so you have to know what to do and uh um that was a big lesson um uh truck maintenance taking taking care of the trucks and the guns and uh how you know how important that is and like what isn't important to take care of in a truck and what's not going on so many mews um fighting rust busting rust uh on uh up armored trucks in the well deck of a of a uh of a ship is like uh retarded to do it's like and it gives you nothing because as soon as you bust the rust like you walk away three minutes later and it's right back yeah um and that was a that was a battle that I had to fight across all four mu deployments um and we would go through I watched go through the same cycle so I went that next deployment I was a driver so I was you know I was heavily involved with the the the vehicles I was our you know I was our uh motor pool guy uh lead the lead driver taking care of our trucks um then so I was you know heavily involved with that and you watch like you're arguing you go through the deployment and then finally like the last month they realize oh this is stupid we don't have to do it anymore you're like why couldn't you listen like at the beginning when we said that to you and we did that every single time uh and before before the 11th mu I decided to get in front of it as at the time I was a sergeant and I told my lieutenant and ultimately the company commander I was like look this bus and rust stuff is ridiculous it's a waste of time it destroys morale trying to scrub rust on an LCU or uh an L cap like jammed in is like how are you how you guys even you got guys laying on the hood trying to scrub down the side of a door it's just it's not gonna do anything I was like this isn't gonna work like the only thing we could possibly do is bust down all the rust prime it and paint it to like so it's perfectly sealed and even that's not gonna work you know because we're actually supposed to use like cark paint and it goes to a sp a specific special place to get sealed and all this I was like so even that's not gonna work so what I what ended up happening was they said okay we're gonna do that so during our buildup and the offload time we pulled all of the weapons company trucks down into the motor pool we bought a bunch of grinders and we actually grinded down all the rust bought this like white primer and spray paint and we actually did that for a week of like uh 12 hour days just just busting rust off of all the trucks and uh we got them back on ship the next time about three or four days later they were all rusted out I was like okay it's fine so it was like it was worth a week of work so that we didn't have to do this nonsense the whole rest of the deployment. Yeah 100% like it was crazy how like how extreme we had to get to prove a point. It's like look I've done this four times like just just listen to what I have to say but like no you have to prove it at every level you have to prove that you're right sometimes right um to get around the dumb stuff. So you know that was a a lesson learned over time. It's like sometimes you gotta do dumb shit to get to where you know to help people get to where they need to be uh because every leadership group is new like their cycle is like you know yeah they were in the line company and they moved up and you know once you learn that kind of chain of evolution you're like okay this guy's gonna like they're not the same person but they're gonna have to learn similar lessons so it's like you got to learn how to be ready to you know guide and help them learn those things too as quickly as possible so you're not you know I still remember shitty working parties. I was like I don't want my guys doing them like unless there's a reason.

SPEAKER_04 37:07

Sure. Well I'm curious do it what uh what shitty working parties did we send you on in Ramadi um well there there was one we uh had to remove the uh the tent the soft top off of a building uh uh I don't I don't remember what the building was um that was either the gym or the chow hole because they were the last ones to get converted right so we went in there

Working Parties Rocket Attack And Aftermath

SPEAKER_04 37:36

this was a huge like there's a huge uh it was uh a a big building and then once we got the tarp down like we didn't think about the tarp itself or like the fabric so we took the poles and everything down so it's laying inside the walls and we and it's just one piece.

SPEAKER_02 37:54

So there's about three or four of us. So we start rolling these things so we got this long noodle and it's like the heaviest piece of fabric that's ever existed and the door is not wide enough to get through and there's a and there's a wall right outside of it. So it's like we're trying to snake it through um we end up trying to lift it up over the wall which is you know probably seven seven feet eight feet like it's not low we're easy like working one end over and trying to snake it over eventually like uh I think tweeter came over at one point and then like kind of tried to help and then was like you know I'm busy you you know and then found a reason to to leave because it was just it was just a mess and we were there for a long time um that was a terrible one it was I mean it was hot as shit every day and of course we're doing this in the middle of the day um that was one of the worst uh working parties um another one was um getting rid of the um the melted doors after the rocket attack um yeah I was gonna ask you if you uh if you remember the rocket attack because I remember it was me and you were getting the truck ready so yeah yes so I remember waking up that morning um and hearing uh you know hearing explosions um I couldn't go back to sleep this time because we were on QRF so I had to I knew like if something happens like that it's like okay we have to be ready to leave which means I have to go get the truck ready. So I run out there um and open the back door I'm getting ready to pull the tow missile out and another explosion. So I kind of hop in the truck for a second assess it's probably another second it's like okay well I still have to get this missile up so I got back out run around I'm gonna put my my PPE on about the time I got there you were there and just donning your peep your uh flak as well and then as I get my uh flak over my head there's like there's an explosion behind me and I'm still not 100% sure if we both jumped in the truck or if we got blown into the truck it could be either or both um but the crazy thing also is that we both while that happened reached out and pulled the doors closed behind us like as we did it because the doors closed so and then we sit there for a second and you're like shit boots you all right I was like yeah sergeant you good he's like yeah you're like get the fucking missile and then it's like rudder so um so once everything was good you know they get the missile uh get the missile in get the 240 ready we're all we're all out there I think uh um bass was down the down the way I think him and uh Neil dove under the truck I'm pretty sure that was the day like uh uh bass drew blood on Neil because he like uh bumped he had a like a hard knife uh a holder on his belt and I think as they both kind of dived towards the truck uh Neil uh cut him cut his uh eyebrow on uh bass's like knife uh knife holder um so we get uh we get ready everybody's there we're in position we sit there for a while um then we get the kind of stand down order um pull the trucks back into our uh our our normal QR QRF positions um everybody goes inside um and I'm on fire I'm on fire watch um now Gunny Marky comes over and he's he's like uh shit boots you're on fire watch is like rise with that gunny that's right and he's like no you're on fire watch you watch that fire because the yeah because the Quad Con is on is on fire yeah uh there's smoke end and um he's like you watch that fire and they say if it gets bigger uh you come and get me so I'm sitting there and I'm watching the fire is like it's starting to grow it's getting bigger it's like I'm having a conversation with myself it's like what is bigger yeah yeah it's like I also don't want to go talk to Gunny. It's like I really don't want to go in the TV I really don't want to go talk to Gunny and it's like what is bigger so I get to the point where like well it's like it's gonna I get comfortable to the point of saying like that is bigger so I should go tell him so I go tell him and he's like good to go go watch it again tell me if it gets bigger it's like okay I guess it's like so the same dilemma again I go back by that time it's like getting bigger it's there's a palette of stuff off to the side and it's getting close to that palette and I was like okay well that's big if it spreads it's bigger so I go back and I tell him he's like okay so he comes out and he just like sounds off and he's like everybody get your e-tools and it's like whenever Gunny Marky says something like everybody starts doing it. And there's just like people uh come out of every hooch with their e tools and they start running towards you know the plan is just to start throwing sand on the fire. The stupidest plan on the planet by the way yeah it is it is so it's like Matt three is guys are like the first ones who are getting close um and I'm still kind of at the I'm on firewash so I'm still kind of watching this happen as everybody like kind of heads that way um and then when the first guy is probably still uh 15 meters away paint that there's just start being these little explosions pop pop pop pop so this pallet was a pallet with paint cans so it just starts exploding they and they all start popping so thankfully no one was injured and Gunny was like well I guess it's you know it is what it is so you know he calls off the that working party and is like well now we just gotta let it burn. I think there was a call in for the fire truck from Junction City and then there was a question on whether we were gonna go get it or not and I think we might have stood up to Get it, but then didn't go. Um, and eventually it did come, and I think it it put water on it, but the fire basically died itself out and they just kind of wet it down. Um and then after it was sufficiently cooled, it we opened it up and you know, looking inside of it, and the to the terminate. I mean, ever all the gunny stash was like destroyed, which he was not happy about because he had, you know, the uh those canvas doors that you guys had had when you came in is like that was in there, but like that was only a part of what was in there. There was a all kinds of different stuff that he had accumulated um for the company, and uh a good amount of it, if not all of it, was just trash. Um but uh those canvas doors um were all melted and just a mess. And the decision was made that they needed to be, you know, gotten rid of. So we uh formed a working party to dispose of them. Um and moving them was was difficult because they all that Kevlar and stuff like or it melted together. So they would sometimes you would get one door, sometimes you get two or four, you know, and then it was really treacherous. And during that working party, I ended up falling into Constantino wire.

SPEAKER_04 45:20

Oh, that was when we were throwing the doors in the river. That's right. Yeah, yeah. We decided to throw the doors in the fucking river. I that wasn't my call, but I remember that. And I remember somebody being like, Anderson's stuck in concertina wire, and I'm like, Why why? We're like, we're throwing the doors in the river, and I was like, I walk out there and you're upside down, like in the fucking converse concertina wire, and Horadsky's laughing maniacally, trying to cut you out of concertina wire, which is it was a mass because we were on some on top of some kind of tank to get up above the wall, and there's a there was a hole in the top of the tank that didn't have a lid on it.

SPEAKER_02 45:55

So as I think I was with Webster, as we went to like chuck one, one of the melted doors like flapped off, so I lost my balance. And it was like either step in to fall into the tank or fall. The other option was fall into the triple train Constantina wire that was just beside it, and I made a call. Um, and I ended up, you know, I ended up in the Constantina wire. Um, I had it, I it hooked my arm, it was like stretched like four inches off, just like just hooked. Oh yeah. And I'm just just like I'm just kind of standing there with like awkward, one leg in. I'm like, get me out, get me out. You know, they're trying to work, work me out of it. Yeah. Um, and when I get unhooked, whoever's in charge of the working party is like, you know, it's like shit moves you, you're done, you can go. Um, and sends me away. It's like, you know, that it was almost over anyway, but they're like, You're good. It's like we can handle this. And I remember coming back, uh, coming back to and like I'm frustrated and uh and you know, angry. Uh, and I see you, and you're like, what the fuck happened to your eye? I was like, what are you talking about? I don't even know. I was like, I didn't even recognize. He's like, Yeah, you got like you got something on your eye. It's like my below my eyelid had been slashed and was bleeding.

SPEAKER_04 47:11

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_02 47:12

It's like I was like a quarter inch away from like losing from being blind.

SPEAKER_04 47:16

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 47:17

And I didn't even didn't even know it. So I went in the bathroom and just kind of looked and checked myself out, cleaned it out, and it's like, and then I went to the smoke pit to decompress and smoked a pack of cigarettes.

SPEAKER_04 47:28

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 47:30

That was that was a rough day for me. That was a rough day.

SPEAKER_04 47:33

That rocket, I I don't know. What what would you estimate? I'm curious, how far do you think of that con X box away was from our truck? Because our truck was the closest truck to that con X box when it blew up.

SPEAKER_02 47:44

It was. So the it there were there were two of them. It hit the one that was slightly farther away. We were pretty much uh just past the corner of this of the second one. So I would say 15 meters, maybe.

SPEAKER_04 48:03

Yeah, it was less it was right next to us. That's uh yeah, exactly right. That's that's what I would say too. Yeah, I would go 30, 50 feet, maybe.

SPEAKER_02 48:11

Yeah, and I remember afterwards and like looking at it, it was like the second, so it hit the one and it blew through the through the two walls of the uh the con X boxes, bowed out the outside, and you could see individual frag marks the side, like six, eight inches of these like pieces of frag that independently uh dented that outside of the bow. And it was like that would have been in our backs.

SPEAKER_05 48:38

Right.

SPEAKER_02 48:39

If if it had been if it had been one over, it would have we would have caught we would have caught scraping all this is like uh amazing that we weren't injured at all. I mean, it's like do you like I didn't even think to get checked about like did we get shaken? Was again it's like it happened so quick.

SPEAKER_03 49:00

Well that that was as crazy as it sounds, that's like a daily occurrence. I mean, like I it it's absolutely crazy when you're on base. I mean, you were going to get mortared, rocketed, shelled some capacity every few days. Gonna get knocked off your feet every once a month. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 49:23

I remember we were worried at one time, I don't remember which one it was, but we were worried that that big boy that we lost big boy because he's like he was in a secret like private time trigger out back.

SPEAKER_05 49:34

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 49:35

And it was like this this mortar stuff happened and it like hit like generally in that area, and everybody's like, holy shit, is like and then he what didn't come around for like longer than it should take, you know. Everybody was legitimately worried, like that he was that he was like seriously injured, but thankfully, you know, uh he was good. He was you know, just one of those uh funny moments. It's like he died, he's gonna die, die taking a shit.

SPEAKER_04 50:05

Well, yeah, I kind of interrupted you. Uh any other memories of any other guys? You kind of mentioned Metroca. Anything else that pops pops to mind?

SPEAKER_02 50:13

Uh I got uh uh I mean I I became friends with the with a lot of guys over time, especially after, but like while we're there, Moselle. I you know, I had time with him on, you know, I got to know guys on on post a lot. Um so I spent time with Moselle. I remember in his uh uh you know, when you were talking to him, he he was talking

The Guys Who Made It Bearable

SPEAKER_02 50:35

about the time we we took fire on the bridge post and uh uh called in uh a guy in a plaid shirt and Matt Three went out there and like yanked him up, yoked him up. Um Bill uh uh got to know him. We had some posts together. Um Radsky, Radsky is was just an amazing driver. Um you know, I was blessed as you know, my whole time in uh weapons company that I I always got good drivers, but Radsky was like he was fearless but smart. He knew how to move the vehicle, he knew how to maneuver in uh those areas in that that traffic, man. That when the traffic would be tight and like nothing more unnerving than being surrounded by a bunch of cars that you could just as easily be a V bid is like you never know. Um but figuring out how to like push through that and navigate that and you know get us through safely. Um Red Man, you know was uh a great mentor, uh gunner, and then you know, getting to know him, he uh on subsequent deployments, uh Swede.

SPEAKER_04 51:58

Um it's it's funny we we call him Redman because he's an American Indian and uh his n his actual name is Mike McCabe, but the most Irish Irish name ever.

SPEAKER_02 52:11

Oh yeah, yeah, for sure. Uh and uh you know I became his I became his driver uh on the next appointment. He was the section he was our the section leader, um and I was his driver.

SPEAKER_01 52:26

Um remember Webster spent his time with him, um got to got to know him.

SPEAKER_02 52:37

Um trying to think of like I said, a lot of the that time, you know, with those guys was more just when we were on post together. It's when I got to know people like that. In between time, it was if we were sitting in the you know, probably mostly the smokers, because that's where I spent most of my time. So Mosey definitely was out there pretty frequently. Uh Newmeyer, um Bill. Um Newmeyer was a it was a character uh scrap. He's hilarious. He's a very unique person. Um you know, he's a farmer now up in Wisconsin.

SPEAKER_04 53:24

And he's and he still is a character, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 53:26

Yeah, yeah. I I've been I've been meaning to get up there to see him. It's just it's a little bit farther of a drive than I can make it right now, but you know, I'd love to see him. Like I man, I wish I could see all you know everybody. It's been so long. Uh I you know, I get to see uh uh Jim from time to time. Um but it's been a couple years, I think, since I've uh actually got to get together with him.

SPEAKER_04 53:49

Um yeah. Yeah, we uh we were fortunate to both me and Blake went to the 20-year reunion, you know, a year and a half ago or whatever it was. Uh I guess almost two years ago now. And uh it was yeah, and it was good. It was really good. Um even though everybody wasn't there, the people we did see it was really good. And I I definitely encourage you to go to one if you whenever they come. I hope I actually hope they come a little more frequently. We don't wait, you know, a decade because fuck there's gonna be 10 of us standing around, everybody's gonna die.

SPEAKER_02 54:22

Right. I know that I mean they've they've had a they've had a few like different ones as uh you know, there's like the the fifth Marines reunion and uh the the 20. I didn't even find out about the 20 year until after it had completed, you know, and kind of the uh the talks on uh the chat that we we got going, which has been uh been cool. Um I don't stay up with it as quick as I as much as much as I'd like to, you know, but I think it's it's awesome that there's you know that everybody still wants to stay in touch, you know, and and check up on everybody. Um that's I hope we can can't.

SPEAKER_04 54:56

That's a good segue to probably something to wrap this up because we've been talking for a couple hours. Um when you look back at this particular time, I mean that it shit. You're as you said, you weren't even in the Marine Corps a year. Uh very formative time frame, which is I I don't know. I never thought about that until literally tonight when we were gonna talk how I can't imagine. I can't imagine being dropped straight out of SOI, straight into combat. That's it's nuts. So you're you and Bass have very a very unique experience as far as weapons company goes.

Meaning Brotherhood And Signing Off

SPEAKER_04 55:29

Uh when you look back on all this, what does all this mean to you and what uh what do you tell people?

SPEAKER_02 55:37

Um I got to do like the dream. What I like what I joined for was to go in to to serve, to be a part of the conflict of the of the era, and I got to do that immediately. There was so many blessings to that. It's like I mentioned a few, like you know, getting right into it, you know, bypassing some of the you know uh rites of passage will say that you know you normally have to go through on a buildup. Um and then experiencing it and realizing that it isn't what you make it up to be. And I've seen that afterwards by Marines, infantry marines, that you know, I mean, I think you guys had even talked about on some of your previous ones, like when you were, you know, in Oki and it's like you're missing out, and it's like there's that thirst for it, and that uh it's on a pedestal, but then when you get it and you're like, man, I could I'll go again, but I would prefer not to. Um and having that having that experience, um and having it early where you know, as I got to serve alongside guys who then were going through that again, and I to the degree that they would listen, be like, look, it's it's not what you're hoping, it's not glory and uh prestige, it's dirty and hot and ugly and gross. And um I hope you don't get what you're asking for because I like you and I don't want you to I don't want you to have to experience it, but like I'll be there with you if we if we get called to it. Um it means brotherhood, accomplishment. It's like it did, it it did help me like realize the level like becoming a Marine was an achievement, and you know, doing something difficult that I earned for myself and joining a legacy, but then going over there and experiencing that and you know, checking that off is like my wife jokes all the time is like I'm not happy unless I'm suffering.

SPEAKER_05 57:47

It's like it's probably sadly accurate.

SPEAKER_02 57:52

Like she's like, the most fun you're having is when it's terrible. And I was like, Yeah, that's probably true. It's probably true.

SPEAKER_04 57:59

Um that that's the most fucking two four thing I think anybody's ever said, right there.

SPEAKER_03 58:04

Uh I think our wives need to start a c uh uh uh a support club for uh having to deal with uh husbands that uh have that as a full last page.

SPEAKER_02 58:14

Yeah, but those are the guys who want with you when it gets hard, right? That's right.

SPEAKER_04 58:23

Well, buddy, it's been great talking to you. Um I'm glad to see you again. I I hope we didn't I hope I I hope I didn't scar you too much calling you chip boots for uh you know six months straight.

SPEAKER_02 58:33

But topping me up, I needed it.

SPEAKER_04 58:37

Um fonder memories, man. I I remember you showing up and being literally an integral part because you're in my truck. You're an integral integral part of my truck. And I I you don't I haven't talked much about my experience, but uh just one little piece that you filled. We started the deployment, we were the smallest platoon. Um with 22 guys or something like that. Out of all the platoons, we were doing a crazy op tempo with nobody. And we got the 3-5 guys, which were wonderful. Um and then we got you and Bass. And it and it was it was nice to be closer to we were never full TO, but we were as close to full TO as we could be. And man, you guys integrated right in. You were you were magic. It was great. It was like you didn't have to teach you that much. You guys were both bright, willing to learn, and you you you were good, man. You were good at it. Even uh, you know, natural, a little bit of natural talent, which was good.

SPEAKER_02 59:38

Yeah, I appreciate that.

SPEAKER_04 59:40

Well, I I guess we'll sign off, man. This has been wonderful. I'm I'm glad to talk to you.

SPEAKER_02 59:45

I agree. Maybe down the road, then do it again.

SPEAKER_04 59:48

Yeah, let's do it again. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 59:51

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